Topic started by Reverend_Jon 2008-11-05 06:35:56 pm

nyahbinghi
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Re: I Blame Obama!

the_Archangel wrote:
DJPsychoFreud wrote:

Why is it that some americans are so afraid of the word socialism?

I remember someone said in the election that "just look at how socialism has destroyed europe",
and here I am in a socialist democracy and we are doing pretty well up here.
I don't need to have an insurance if I get sick, my taxes already paid for it.  Universities, colleges and other schools are free, everything medical is free, and all that means is that everyone can get education and medical treatment even if they are poor.

I might be wrong, I am just wondering.

A certain portion of America is afraid of socialism as a leftover from the Red Scares of the 30's and particularly the 50's and 60's.  These are the same people that want their world to look like 1950's television, a la "Leave it to Beaver" and "Donna Reed."  They also would like for every yard to be manicured, nobody (visible) to be poor, and to not have to worry about seeing minorites anywhere but in an orchard in California.  They are leftovers from a generation passing by, and even though some of them successfully impart that fear and outdated mentality of conservativism on to their children, for the most part, their rabid fear and hatred does nothing but drive their children further left, as was the case with me.

Personally, I'm a utopian anarchist/socialist libertarian, but if I had to choose a "realistic" form of government, it would be democratic socialism all the way.  Free health care for poor kids?  Fuck yes I would pay taxes for that.  I would rather have 25% of the people on government-assisted pay abuse the system than have 50% of my taxes go to the department of "defense" and homeland security.  Hell, I'd rather have 95% of the people on "welfare" programs be abusing the system than spend one more penny on dropping bombs on second-world countries.

I agree 100%

Last edited by nyahbinghi (2008-11-07 01:40:42 pm)

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Commie Dread
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Re: I Blame Obama!

the_Archangel wrote:

Repubilcan, democrat...  It makes no difference.  Don't try to say that you're on the side of the good guys just because the other side is full of bad guys.  Both sides of that fence are as backwards and power mad as the other.

did u vote for nader, moore or that green black chick then?

TRANSDUTOR wrote:

if i am not wrong, Russia was comunism govern, not socialism...

russia was governed by a bunch of powerhungry assholes, just like everywhere else. difference is they called themselves communists and the system socialism. truth is neither never really existed, except for cuba maybe....

boom-chick--boomchick-

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TRANSDUTOR
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Re: I Blame Obama!

I believe Cuba wish to be capitalist nowaday...

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Miss Peace
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Re: I Blame Obama!

٩(̾●̮̮̃̾•̃̾)۶

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the_Archangel
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Re: I Blame Obama!

Commie Dread wrote:
the_Archangel wrote:

Repubilcan, democrat...  It makes no difference.  Don't try to say that you're on the side of the good guys just because the other side is full of bad guys.  Both sides of that fence are as backwards and power mad as the other.

did u vote for nader, moore or that green black chick then?

I voted for Obama, simply for the fact that I knew that my state was going to be damn close (And it was), and that Obama needed my fake vote that was probably predetermined anyway, and did nothing other than make me feel like I violated my principles, but at least my wife gave me good loving in exchange for my actually going to vote.

I wanted to not vote at all.  Nader was probably the best choice, but let's be serious.

What is the offering of our tongues of dust compared with the knowledge of the divinities?

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Reverend_Jon
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Re: I Blame Obama!

-DjZ- wrote:

who runs the majority of the house then?


Didn't the house shoot down the first draft of the 700 billion package, then ultimately stressed into passing the second draft?

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Reverend_Jon
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Re: I Blame Obama!

the_Archangel wrote:

I wanted to not vote at all.  Nader was probably the best choice, but let's be serious.

Ron Paul?

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the_Archangel
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Re: I Blame Obama!

Reverend_Jon wrote:
the_Archangel wrote:

I wanted to not vote at all.  Nader was probably the best choice, but let's be serious.

Ron Paul?

On the surface, sure, but I read some shit about him that I didn't like.

What it boils down to is that I don't think that anyone that has ever run for public office has been worth the paper that the ballots are printed on.  That, and the fact that I personally don't need a government or a god to babysit me just turns me off the whole damn deal.  ...My true, pure, honest choice for who I wanted to vote for?  Fucking nobody.  I swore off voting years ago because I neither belive in the system of voting, nor the presence of government itself.  The sole reason that I voted this time was because I had to do something, however meaningless, symbolic, and selfish, to try to make Sarah Palin go away.  She's GWB with boobs and a worse attitude, and far less subtlety (With a comparable intelligence).  I can only hope that she disappears forever, because her rhetoric and method of politicizing reminds me of a young Stalin or Pol Pot.

So yeah, if not for her, I wouldn't have voted at all.  I'm happy that Obama won, but not happy enough to have made me want to vote in hindsight.

What is the offering of our tongues of dust compared with the knowledge of the divinities?

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markh
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Re: I Blame Obama!

TRANSDUTOR wrote:

if i am not wrong, Russia was comunism govern, not socialism...

USSR = Union of Soviet Socialist Republics

i dunno transdutor, i'd say it was both.... and a thinly veiled dictatorship.


Archangel wrote:

....to try to make DjZ go away.  He's GWB with boobs and a worse attitude, and far less subtlety (With a comparable intelligence).  I can only hope that she disappears forever, because her rhetoric and method of politicizing reminds me of a young Stalin or Pol Pot

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konekta
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Re: I Blame Obama!

markh wrote:

Archangel wrote:

....to try to make DjZ go away.  He's GWB with boobs and a worse attitude, and far less subtlety (With a comparable intelligence).  I can only hope that she disappears forever, because her rhetoric and method of politicizing reminds me of a young Stalin or Pol Pot

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Commie Dread
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Re: I Blame Obama!

markh wrote:
TRANSDUTOR wrote:

if i am not wrong, Russia was comunism govern, not socialism...

USSR = Union of Soviet Socialist Republics

i dunno transdutor, i'd say it was both.... and a thinly veiled dictatorship.

it was neither. ever read marx? u should, everyone should. ud know for instance, that socialism is the precursor of communism, which can only be achieved thru revolution

boom-chick--boomchick-

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markh
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Re: I Blame Obama!

Commie Dread wrote:
markh wrote:
TRANSDUTOR wrote:

if i am not wrong, Russia was comunism govern, not socialism...

USSR = Union of Soviet Socialist Republics

i dunno transdutor, i'd say it was both.... and a thinly veiled dictatorship.

it was neither.

technically i suppose that's true. see previous post about humans not being wired correctly for socialism and/or communism. i think it helps explain why the USSR failed.

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-DjZ-
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Re: I Blame Obama!

the_Archangel wrote:



Repubilcan, democrat...  It makes no difference.  Don't try to say that you're on the side of the good guys just because the other side is full of bad guys.  Both sides of that fence are as backwards and power mad as the other.

Why do you want to blame a party so badly?  Why do you need that?  Can you not accept that politicians in general are the problem?  Do you need an "other" to blame?  Do you associate your ideologies and belief with the GOP so closely that whenever someone says something positive about a democrat (or votes one into an office) that you take it personally?  If someone says that GWB is a megalomaniacal monster that is controlled by an even more megalomaniacal monster in Cheney, who is controlled my megalithic corporations bent on doing nothing other than bleeding you and the rest of the world dry and then getting away with it by pandering to your most basic urges to have an "old fashioned," freedoms loving, white, non-dirty-foreigner, Christian world that has been totally homogenized to the point of the lifelessness of Lawrence Welk honkeyjazz, does that offend you personally?  Even though someone is calling them the bad guy, and not you?  Does it offend you because you truly believe that your spiritual leaders (in a political sense) are one and the same as your sense of self worth?  Can you not recognize that you are an individual, and that maybe, just maybe, these fallable people that may or may not have been elected into office have ulterior motives that may not be in the best interests of the world around you?

Man...  I think that I was saying all that to my Dad, and not you.  LMAO.  tongue

markh wrote:

^^^ again expanding (condensing?) on Arch's excellent post...

Socialism is not inherently bad. The problem is humans aren't wired for it, especially Americans.

One of the good things about capitialism is that you can make your own future. You have some say in how much money you are going to make, i.e. how hard are you going to work for it. Humans are wired this way.

the_Archangel wrote:

Humans, on the other hand, are fearful, power hungry, xenophobic monsters that will use any system of government to control and manipulate the population for their own selfish gains.

also...  R E L I G I O N  !!!!!

Religion is great on paper.  wink

pol pot calling the kettle black eh?  Am I the only person blaming the other side?  Seems to me yall are doing so more than I am.  Oh great black fucking leader.  Make the wold a better place!!    pfft.

Dont read this.

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-DjZ-
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Re: I Blame Obama!

btw.  If you wanna make me go away so badly then ban me.  ;P

Dont read this.

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dogmeat
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Re: I Blame Obama!

-DjZ- wrote:

btw.  If you wanna make me go away so badly then ban me.  ;P

It can be arranged.

tongue

smile

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the_Archangel
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Re: I Blame Obama!

-DjZ- wrote:
the_Archangel wrote:

Repubilcan, democrat...  It makes no difference.  Don't try to say that you're on the side of the good guys just because the other side is full of bad guys.  Both sides of that fence are as backwards and power mad as the other.

Why do you want to blame a party so badly?  Why do you need that?  Can you not accept that politicians in general are the problem?  Do you need an "other" to blame?  Do you associate your ideologies and belief with the GOP so closely that whenever someone says something positive about a democrat (or votes one into an office) that you take it personally?  If someone says that GWB is a megalomaniacal monster that is controlled by an even more megalomaniacal monster in Cheney, who is controlled my megalithic corporations bent on doing nothing other than bleeding you and the rest of the world dry and then getting away with it by pandering to your most basic urges to have an "old fashioned," freedoms loving, white, non-dirty-foreigner, Christian world that has been totally homogenized to the point of the lifelessness of Lawrence Welk honkeyjazz, does that offend you personally?  Even though someone is calling them the bad guy, and not you?  Does it offend you because you truly believe that your spiritual leaders (in a political sense) are one and the same as your sense of self worth?  Can you not recognize that you are an individual, and that maybe, just maybe, these fallable people that may or may not have been elected into office have ulterior motives that may not be in the best interests of the world around you?

Man...  I think that I was saying all that to my Dad, and not you.  LMAO.  tongue

markh wrote:

^^^ again expanding (condensing?) on Arch's excellent post...

Socialism is not inherently bad. The problem is humans aren't wired for it, especially Americans.

One of the good things about capitialism is that you can make your own future. You have some say in how much money you are going to make, i.e. how hard are you going to work for it. Humans are wired this way.



also...  R E L I G I O N  !!!!!

Religion is great on paper.  wink

pol pot calling the kettle black eh?  Am I the only person blaming the other side?  Seems to me yall are doing so more than I am.  Oh great black fucking leader.  Make the wold a better place!!    pfft.

I think that both sides are filled with mindless retards and sheep.  I think that politicians on both sides are selfish megalomaniacal snakes.

I'm not on either side.

Seems like you're really quick to say that he's going to ruin the world, and the man hasn't even spent a day in office.  Give him at least a few days after inauguration to fuck up.

Democrats are too happy, and republicans are too angry.  The man won the election, nothing more.  He hasn't made on single policy decision, and everyone is acting like it's either the end of the world or the beginning of a new era.

I'm personally optimistic, but only because it really can't get too much worse.  Bush took twenty steps backwards, and hopefully, Obama can take us at least ten steps forwards.  We'll still be in shit city, and we'll probably be right where they wanted us all along, but hey, whatever.  You can't do shit about it.

What is the offering of our tongues of dust compared with the knowledge of the divinities?

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-DjZ-
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Re: I Blame Obama!

true.

im done

sorry for all the people I riled up. 
Except markh,  hes still a douche.

Dont read this.

www.myspace.com/superherodjzmusic

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the_Archangel
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Re: I Blame Obama!

-DjZ- wrote:

true.

im done

sorry for all the people I riled up. 
Except markh,  hes still a douche.

Never apologize for expressing your views, no matter how backwards and knee-jerk they may appear to some people.  wink

What is the offering of our tongues of dust compared with the knowledge of the divinities?

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markh
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Re: I Blame Obama!

the_Archangel wrote:

Democrats are too happy, and republicans are too angry.  The man won the election, nothing more.  He hasn't made on single policy decision, and everyone is acting like it's either the end of the world or the beginning of a new era.

It is the beginning of a new era. Obama's story makes it so. Nobody's ever done what he's done. I'm hopeful it will turn out great, but know there's a chance it won't.

the_Archangel wrote:

Both sides of that fence are as backwards and power mad as the other.

power mad, sure who doesn't want to be in charge?
backwards, no fucking way. the religious right is more backwards and proud of it. they put the USA back in deep hole.

also.. I'm not a democrat, although most of my views are closer to theirs than republicans, but not all. 8 years of W made it painfully obvious why we have the right to bare arms.

Last edited by markh (2008-11-07 09:23:34 pm)

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markh
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Re: I Blame Obama!

-DjZ- wrote:

Except markh,  hes still a douche.

fuck off cunt

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konekta
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Re: I Blame Obama!

-DjZ- wrote:

sorry for all the people I riled up. 
Except markh,  hes still a douche.

-DjZ- wrote:

Make the wold a better place!!    pfft.

you're the whole fucking anal douche unit though, including all anal secretions that follow. smile

Last edited by konekta (2008-11-07 09:23:00 pm)

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the_Archangel
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Re: I Blame Obama!

markh wrote:
the_Archangel wrote:

Democrats are too happy, and republicans are too angry.  The man won the election, nothing more.  He hasn't made on single policy decision, and everyone is acting like it's either the end of the world or the beginning of a new era.

It is the beginning of a new era. Obama's story makes it so. Nobody's ever done what he's done. I'm hopeful it will turn out great, but know there's a chance it won't.

I'm hopeful, too, and for the first time in years, but...  You don't get to be president just because you're a good guy that got a lot of votes.  I'm scared about what we don't know, because what makes a politician a politician scares the crap out of me.  And no... I'm not "wondering who the real Obama is" like all of the neo-con pundits.  I'm wondering who he's going to be working for, just like I wonder that about every politician.  I hope that he works for us, like he's supposed to, but I'm not holding my breath.  God, I hope he does some good.

markh wrote:
the_Archangel wrote:

Both sides of that fence are as backwards and power mad as the other.

power mad, sure who doesn't want to be in charge?
backwards, no fucking way. the religious right is more backwards and proud of it. they put the USA back in deep hole.

I don't want to be in charge.  Hell, I don't want *anyone* to be in charge.  wink

Yeah, backwards was a bad choice of word there.  I agree that the rabidly conservative base of the GOP is backwards in ways that the rest of the country can't begin to understand, in that they want to take steps backwards in the evolution of civilization.  The only positive step backwards is all the way backwards, to 10,000 years ago.  As that's not possible, the only way to go is forward, because, frankly, the good ol' days sucked unless you were in a black and white sitcom.  The real world doesn't work in the way that these people want it to.

I should have said "Both sides of that fence are as evil and power mad as the other."

markh wrote:

also.. I'm not a democrat, although most of views are closer to theirs than republicans, but not all. 8 years of W made it painfully obvious why we have the right to bare arms.

If I had to pick one of the two major sides, I'd pick democrat, too, but...  That's only out of relation to the GOP.  I'm waaaaaaay further left than the democrats can ever hope to be.  Hell, I'm probably not even on that whole left/right spectrum. 

Grownups don't need babysitters.  When give that power away, it makes us act like we do, though.

What is the offering of our tongues of dust compared with the knowledge of the divinities?

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NattyRuler
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Re: I Blame Obama!

U can pick apart any party or any person all day so he will have his acomplishments and shortcomings just like all of us. every presidents job description is always the same and it would be hard pressed of anyone to say he is gonna change that. Reality is that the evelotuon of the republican party over the past decade has been so gawd awful that by comparison he seems amazing. Even if he ends up being Only mediocre as a president in his acomplisments that will be a HUGE change from where we stand now. I do think he was the best realistic choice we had by far to lead this country and i dont know how his presidency will be but i take comfort in the fact that we will have a president who governs with logic and reason as his primary evaluation tools rather then Fear and blind ambition.

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DJPsychoFreud
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Re: I Blame Obama!

I think the word "socialism" in the US gets too much associated with communism.
It is not (always) the same thing, it all depends.  For example Norway and Sweden
are socialist democracies, which are monarchies at the same time. 

Norway has been rated best country to live in many times by the UN.

So i do not agree that humans are not "wired" for socialism, I think that some people
connect the word with different values.

smile

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the_Archangel
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Re: I Blame Obama!

NattyRuler wrote:

U can pick apart any party or any person all day so he will have his acomplishments and shortcomings just like all of us. every presidents job description is always the same and it would be hard pressed of anyone to say he is gonna change that. Reality is that the evelotuon of the republican party over the past decade has been so gawd awful that by comparison he seems amazing. Even if he ends up being Only mediocre as a president in his acomplisments that will be a HUGE change from where we stand now. I do think he was the best realistic choice we had by far to lead this country and i dont know how his presidency will be but i take comfort in the fact that we will have a president who governs with logic and reason as his primary evaluation tools rather then Fear and blind ambition.

Plus, it will be nice to have a president that has a firm grasp on the English language.  I have always been aware of the fac tthat eloquence is extremely important for public office, but never realized the depths to which my respect for a president would sink simply by hearing him stutter and slur ridiculously ignorant inanities in a fake Texas accent.   Obama's public speaking abilities remind me of Kennedy's.

I honeslty can't believe that anit-Obama people actually act like his eloquence is a bad thing.  "He's a smooth talker, actin' all refined and city like, tryin' to sell you snake oil with his big book learnin' words."

What is the offering of our tongues of dust compared with the knowledge of the divinities?

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